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SamanthaF
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SamanthaF

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2 months ago
Shikaree (2 months ago) #27112223ChocolateSpider (2 months ago) #27061547snip
Would be interested in how this turns out.

I'm still... skeptical... about what PayPal has said. IC3 is clear in that they handle illegal activities over the internet. IC3 will also make no communication after you submit your complaint. I have a hard time believing the local police department at where AI is located will care they went out of business.

Honestly the FBI part sounds like complete B.S. (from the part of the PayPal agent). It's not the FBI's job to "investigate" whether someone went out of business. The only thing that matters is whether PayPal will open a dispute for it or not. If they want to pretend FBI is the reason why they do, more power to them.


I agree with you and do not believe a PayPal rep said this at all. If they did they went far off script mainly for the following reasons,

1. they alluded to the promise of a refund for an order over 180 days based on something they cannot control or even confirm.
2. Them refunding people over 180 is not and never will be based on some outside info, it is based on PayPal's own RULES of which they want to keep as slim as possible to maximize profit (it is not profitable to refund customers back a year or two on undelivered orders)
3. If PayPal was fishing for anything, it would be if Anime Island Intended to file bankruptcy so PayPal can wash their hands of paying dispute refunds and hope AI included any un-refunded customers as creditors (basically PayPal stops paying and any money owed to the customer is cleared by a bankruptcy).
4. a business shutting down a website or closing a store location has no effect on refund or dispute policy, if you ordered an item and it was never delivered, it simply was not delivered as promised and you should be able to dispute that transaction and receive a refund, no other circumstances of the business and it's daily actions will affect these simple details.

Everything about this interaction with the Paypal rep sounds like someone going off script and just trying to get the customer to end the call so that the rep can move onto the next call. At least with Anime Island they stabbed us in the face and just closed, PayPal stabs you in the back with words and bullshit policies (180 days is their policy that used to be only 45 days just 2-3 years ago) all the while making you think using them is safe when it certainly is not.
Updated 2 months ago #27147848

Emillia
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Emillia

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2 months ago
SamanthaF (2 months ago) #27147848Everything about this interaction with the Paypal rep sounds like someone going off script and just trying to get the customer to end the call so that the rep can move onto the next call. At least with Anime Island they stabbed us in the face and just closed, PayPal stabs you in the back with words and bullshit policies (180 days is their policy that used to be only 45 days just 2-3 years ago) all the while making you think using them is safe when it certainly is not.

Yes, I think people need to think more about the fact that banks and Payapl operate in totally different ways. Paypal can certainly be the best option in some circumstances for various reasons, but they're basically not bound by anything or answerable to anyone other than themselves and their own policies. And they make their money off of transactions, so their thing is to encourage everyone to make as many transactions through them as possible, which includes making themselves out to be the safest and most secure option, even if that is not always the case. Banks have a different set of priorities. They want to keep you as a long term customer, they want your salary/income being paid to them, they want you to eventually come to them for that big loan for a car/home/etc, so they've got more of an investment in trying to keep you happy to at least some degree. Plus banks are bound by whatever consumer protection laws and anti-fraud laws and banking sector laws etc are in place in their country of operation, as well as by mastercard and visa rules in the case of credit cards.
  #27156728

SamanthaF
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SamanthaF

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2 months ago
Emillia (2 months ago) #27156728SamanthaF (2 months ago) #27147848Everything about this interaction with the Paypal rep sounds like someone going off script and just trying to get the customer to end the call so that the rep can move onto the next call. At least with Anime Island they stabbed us in the face and just closed, PayPal stabs you in the back with words and bullshit policies (180 days is their policy that used to be only 45 days just 2-3 years ago) all the while making you think using them is safe when it certainly is not.

Yes, I think people need to think more about the fact that banks and Payapl operate in totally different ways. Paypal can certainly be the best option in some circumstances for various reasons, but they're basically not bound by anything or answerable to anyone other than themselves and their own policies. And they make their money off of transactions, so their thing is to encourage everyone to make as many transactions through them as possible, which includes making themselves out to be the safest and most secure option, even if that is not always the case. Banks have a different set of priorities. They want to keep you as a long term customer, they want your salary/income being paid to them, they want you to eventually come to them for that big loan for a car/home/etc, so they've got more of an investment in trying to keep you happy to at least some degree. Plus banks are bound by whatever consumer protection laws and anti-fraud laws and banking sector laws etc are in place in their country of operation, as well as by mastercard and visa rules in the case of credit cards.


Exactly. People also need to understand that if they used PayPal and had the funds taken from a credit card (Amex, visa, MC , or discover) that they can file a claim with their credit card company or bank for that PayPal payment. 180 days time frame is with PayPal directly but possibly not with the source of the funds that were used via PayPal's interface (unless you funded via check or PayPal credit then you are screwed).
  #27163882

achaye
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achaye

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2 months ago
Well, this is disappointing - there goes my Stardust pre-order. I'm with Capital One credit card - I'll see what they can do about a pre-order from over a year ago (made in Sept-2016). I just e-mailed sales@anime-island.com, and the e-mail didn't bounce, but I'm wondering at this point whether I'll even get a response, or if I should just start the dispute process immediately.
  #27165064

SamanthaF
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SamanthaF

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2 months ago
achaye (2 months ago) #27165064Well, this is disappointing - there goes my Stardust pre-order. I'm with Capital One credit card - I'll see what they can do about a pre-order from over a year ago (made in Sept-2016). I just e-mailed sales@anime-island.com, and the e-mail didn't bounce, but I'm wondering at this point whether I'll even get a response, or if I should just start the dispute process immediately.

I posted on a blog or two here about this very thing. Do not wait (read on, sorry if it is a mess I copied/pasted replies I posted on different pages here)

So Anime Island disappearing into the abyss (without a post or email notice or anything) certainly does have it's benefits for the time being, now if they declare bankruptcy then everything changes, as PayPal may wait it out to see if the company includes each customer as a creditor (this saves PayPal untold amounts of money). Remember PayPal is out for itself and these refund limits (180 days) are their limits alone, it is them not wanting to refund you the money (whether AI owes it to them or not, PayPal is in the business of making money not refunding customers). It wasn't too long ago (about 2-3 yrs ago) that PayPal would only refund back to 45 days, after years of people complaining and them getting disputes thru credit card companies, they begrudgingly moved the refund date back to 180 days. I do not believe for a second these people on here thinking a IC3 report or a BBB report are going to work to get anything further back from PayPal (if you are over 180 days) I cannot find a single instance of anyone online, nor any post via reddit or PayPal forums ever even mentioning being refunded (BY PAYPAL themselves) over 180 days, only a bank or credit card company dispute over that time limit has forced their hand.

I would suggest to anyone waiting to see if AI comes back (LOL they aren't at this point) or for any other reason they didn't yet file a dispute, file your disputes/claims asap in case things change in the short term at which point we are subject to PayPal not wanting to refund anyone further or them offering lowered amounts. AI posting or not should have no sway on your decision to file a dispute right now (not tomorrow or next week), they are gone, lets get back to talking about figures and beyond this mess.


Not one single person has received an email or anything since beginning of last week. I mentioned in another post on the company's MFC page, that everyone should not wait to file a dispute or claim for your money (I have experience with this thru my job). If Anime Island does file bankruptcy, it can put us consumers at a disadvantage with getting FULL refunds via credit cards, banks and or PayPal. Right now without any info, Anime Island is simply a vendor who did not deliver on the goods ordered, once they file bankruptcy they could list any one of us or all of us as a creditor therefor relieving them of the debt in the eyes of the state and federal gov and at the same time technically relieving the banks, card processors and PayPal of paying us back on their debts as these companies are currently doing.

TLDR: File your claims with your banks and Paypal, do not wait. No one is coming back or manning any hypothetical ship.
Updated 2 months ago #27165582

naikousei
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naikousei

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2 months ago
achaye (2 months ago) #27165064Well, this is disappointing - there goes my Stardust pre-order. I'm with Capital One credit card - I'll see what they can do about a pre-order from over a year ago (made in Sept-2016). I just e-mailed sales@anime-island.com, and the e-mail didn't bounce, but I'm wondering at this point whether I'll even get a response, or if I should just start the dispute process immediately.

Do it now. They won't reply, answer phones, nothing. I had two on order with them at a great price. ($108) Honestly, even before this started, they were acting REALLY weird when I pressed as to whether or not they'd actually get her in, sited GSC as the distribution company (wrong)... it just felt bad. When she came out I grabbed one off Big in Japan on a whim, since I had such a bad gut feeling.

There was an eBay 20% code that ended a few days ago allowing you to get her from a reputable seller there for $120. I tried posting it on the Myethos club but I don't think anyone saw in time. :[

Keep an eye on AmiAmi, they got a few in a couple days ago.
I was born for this.
Updated 2 months ago #27167348

achaye
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achaye

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2 months ago
Thanks guys, that was very informative and makes perfect sense. I'm going to file a dispute right away and will keep everyone here updated in case anyone has a Capital One credit card and is wondering how it will go. This is for a single fully prepaid Stardust Vocaloid Myethos figure.
  #27167707

EternalVendetta
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EternalVendetta

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2 months ago
I just got purchase adjustments from Capital One for my preorders that hadn't been refunded - one was from as far back as March of this year; I'd filed a dispute about 1-2 weeks ago. Capital One did note that I'd be receiving a letter in the mail asking for more information about the orders, which would determine if the adjustments would stay or not; I expect that this is where I will provide email order confirmations that detail when the items were supposed to come out, which are almost entirely on dates in the future.

I'm not out of the woods yet, but this development at least seems to be a step in the right direction. Good luck to everyone else still working on their refunds.
Updated 2 months ago #27171082

naikousei
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naikousei

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2 months ago
Also, if you're under the 180 days, file a claim with PayPal and wait the 10 days or so they give the seller a chance to respond during, but do NOT contact your credit card company at the same time. PayPal will close your claim since you can't get the money back twice. If PayPal doesn't side with you, for some absurd reason, THEN call your bank/CC company.
I was born for this.
Updated 2 months ago #27172429

katongmeinv
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katongmeinv

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1 month ago
After reading the posts above about if they file bankruptcy & how it would affect people still owed, I spoke with a person at the BBB customer service line to see if they knew anything about this type of issue. Now in a prior post, I said the BBB claims sounded like a total waste of time due to local issue knowledge, I have since changed my mind a little with this new info below, if after exhausting all other options you are still left without any sort of funds, read the following.

So I called the Better Business Bureau and spoke with a person there about the situation on my older orders and they said that even though they (THE BBB) may not be able to get funds back from the company, they would send the company your info you provide as well as the amount you list as owed. This way they said it provides a paper trail should any remaining assets of Anime Island's be available or sold (if they file bankruptcy of some type) that proceeds from those sales may go toward customers owed, even if it is a partial payment it would be better than nothing. Their website to file a claim is [ext link ]

DO NOT file a claim with BBB if you already disputed an order thru your credit card, PayPal, bank or similar institution as if you are refunded this would be double dipping and would be disqualified, do not include amounts you may be already getting refunded on by any of the previous as this may disqualify other un-reimbursed funds from being partially returned. Make sure you exhaust every other outlet prior to doing this as this would be the last resort but would make sure that AI knows you are still owed money and were unable to get your funds back thru your payment form.
Updated 1 month ago #27187756

weeb
lexiechan
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weeb

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1 month ago
got my first two refunds (20% deposits from last april) !!!
finally got to escalate them to paypal last night, got my refunds today but the cases are still under review?
worried if i close them AI will cancel the refunds or sth as once i close a claim i cant re open it :<
(i paid these two with my paypal balance and the two im still waiting on were via paypal but from my debit card hopefully they get sorted monday :@)
Updated 1 month ago #27189427

R_Kasahara
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R_Kasahara

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1 month ago
EternalVendetta (2 months ago) #27171082I just got purchase adjustments from Capital One for my preorders that hadn't been refunded - one was from as far back as March of this year; I'd filed a dispute about 1-2 weeks ago. Capital One did note that I'd be receiving a letter in the mail asking for more information about the orders, which would determine if the adjustments would stay or not; I expect that this is where I will provide email order confirmations that detail when the items were supposed to come out, which are almost entirely on dates in the future.

I'm not out of the woods yet, but this development at least seems to be a step in the right direction. Good luck to everyone else still working on their refunds.

I might as well provide an update on my own credit card disputes, since it may give some others here an idea of what to expect. There were three, all filed online with Citi on October 9, all for full deposits for unfulfilled preorders. Save for the dates and dollar amounts, the information I provided was more or less identical; for preorders for items which hadn't come out yet, I was asked about Anime Island's status, to which I replied that they had gone out of business. "Conditional credits" were applied for the full amounts to my account. I haven't been told I would need to file any additional paperwork, but I do have the order and payment confirmation emails from Anime Island saved to my hard drive just in case.

One of these disputes, for an S.H.Figuarts due out in the US this month, was fully resolved in my favor on the 12th. This particular dispute was also for the least amount of money, $44.66, and the conditional credit I was given for this amount was made permanent. For the other two, one is for items that I was supposed to get by June 30th, and the other is for upcoming preorders like the resolved dispute, but is also for the most amount of money, over $150. According to Citi, the merchant has until December 4 to reply to them. This whole process will likely take a bit more time, but that the first dispute was resolved so quickly has me feeling somewhat optimistic.

In the meantime, I reordered most of the items from those orders at other shops (and I highly recommend that others do so for their own lost Anime Island preorders if possible, provided you can afford it and haven't done so already). I got lucky in that one shop still had the items that were due from Anime Island this past summer, and at another, preorders for a different set of items hadn't closed. There are two figures, both figma, I haven't reordered, having decided to take my chances with getting them after release, but everything else is taken care of now.
Updated 1 month ago #27189876

TeTe
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TeTe

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1 month ago
Hi, just wondering what happens once the seller failed to give PP a response by the given deadline?
  #27246770

weeb
lexiechan
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weeb

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1 month ago
TeTe (1 month ago) #27246770Hi, just wondering what happens once the seller failed to give PP a response by the given deadline?paypal review the case themselves, in my case i got a refund same day
still waiting for two more refunds tho
  #27247073

Lehst
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Lehst

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1 month ago
I just got an email from PayPal, stating one of my claims was closed in my favor. This is the 10th day without seller response, so I got a refund. Still waiting on a few more refunds, but I read somewhere it could take up to 48 hrs for them to get around to reviewing cases that hit the 10-day deadline. Lol I'll be checking throughout the day.

EDIT: just got my second claim's refund. I expect the rest aren't far behind.
Updated 1 month ago #27248718

adrikyn
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adrikyn

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1 month ago
I got my refund from Paypal today... It was a payment on two items, one of which I got, and despite telling them I only needed X amount back, they just refunded the whole thing?

Well... I'm still out money from MHToyshop, so I'm not going to complain. I was honest, I guess they just don't do partial refunds.
  #27260355

Lehst
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Lehst

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1 month ago
adrikyn (1 month ago) #27260355I got my refund from Paypal today... It was a payment on two items, one of which I got, and despite telling them I only needed X amount back, they just refunded the whole thing?

Well... I'm still out money from MHToyshop, so I'm not going to complain. I was honest, I guess they just don't do partial refunds.

Interesting. They have a lot of rules so I guess they couldn't easily do a partial refund... but yeah you were honest!

I originally had another transaction that I messaged the seller thru paypal for since the deadline was that same day Oct 4th. Later I went thru my emails to figure out which transaction was which, and confirmed it was an order I did receive. So naturally, I closed the dispute before escalating to Paypal's review. But sometimes I wonder, what would have happened if I had escalated it. Maybe I'd have gotten a refund I didn't deserve. :p

But I wouldn't do that. And plus, I'd just worry over it being checked and having it affect my other refunds.
  #27273150

ponkan
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ponkan

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1 month ago
Has anyone had any success getting Paypal to refund preorders past the 180 day limit?
  #27276954

blackmoongirl
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blackmoongirl

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1 month ago
ponkan (1 month ago) #27276954Has anyone had any success getting Paypal to refund preorders past the 180 day limit?
No, but I just got off with talking to my bank 10 minutes ago and from what I read into here: (mfc link) and from the exchange it seems like it worked??? My bank (which uses Visa), after a bit of fighting and stern words (no cussing) to get a human on the phone when being transferred, found the transactions and told me it'd take about 10 days for claims to investigate the situation and I should be refunded for the written amounts since the store shut down and I didn't get anything. Crossing my fingers to see if it works. @3@;;
Updated 1 month ago #27277291

staaare
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staaare

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1 month ago
I just wanted to thank you all for posting your experiences and suggestions. I only became aware of the issue on Sunday after watching a review of Figma Rem & Ram. I decided to check the status of my 3 paid-in-full transactions from May '17 (4 pre-ordered figures for a total of $205) with Anime-Island and discovered that the site no longer exists. Were it not for this site, I would have been significantly more anxious about what the heck was happening. It's a shame about AI. I've ordered from them several times in the past and always had great experiences. As a long time employee of a small, family business, I can sympathize with the shop to an extent. There was a time when we were discussing whether or not we could open the doors for business on a daily basis and the decision to call it quits or continue to plow on, hoping for a miracle can be heart-rending. We were extremely lucky that things turned around for us, but it could have just as easily gone the other way and a lot of good vendors would have been left in the lurch. It sounds like they tried their best to refund what they could, and that's about all you can do in that situation. Some kind of communication would have been nice, but perhaps they were advised not to for legal reasons.

I contacted USAA today (the issuer of my Visa CC) and they had me fax 17 pages worth of information to them. I should have a response in 3-5 days. I really appreciate the Visa terms blog post from katongmeinv as that went a long way in alleviating my anxiety and definitely carried some weight with the representative I talked to.

The positive side of all of this for me is that of the four Figmas I ordered, there were only two that I still really wanted and they were easy enough to get from another store for only a few shekels more than I paid at AI. Fingers crossed.
Updated 1 month ago #27281422

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